#geowebchat transcript, 26 July 2011


mappingmashups Good morning/afternoon/evening everyone, and welcome to our first #geowebchat. As we get started, could we do a round of introductions? -11:03 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups If you haven’t done a twitter chat before (I’m new at it myself), just remember to include the #geowebchat hashtag in each tweet. -11:03 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson Hi Alan, and thanks again for organizing this. I’m Peter Johnson, post doc researcher at McGill http://t.co/i8SSodr #geowebchat -11:03 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mhaklay @mappingmashups hello and thanks for the initiative to start the #geowebchat -11:03 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @peterajohnson Nice to see you Peter. I’m a PhD Candidate at UBC. Not a lot of geoweb ppl at UBC, which helped motivate this #geowebchat. -11:05 AM Jul 26th, 2011


burnsr77 thanks indeed, @mappingmashups. ryan burns here from university of washington geography. phd student. #geowebchat -11:07 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups If you can’t configure your twitter client to only show the hashtag during the chat, this site is handy: http://bit.ly/oYd8Fn #geowebchat -11:07 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mappingmashups all depends how you define the #geoweb Probably more people who are at least somewhat involved. #geowebchat -11:07 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups Also, I will try to save a transcript of the chat after the fact, for those who can’t attend. #geowebchat -11:09 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups Welcome @burnsr77 and @mhaklay! I love semi-global & international spread we’ve got already, with just the first four of us. #geowebchat -11:10 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson making revisions to a book chapter on government use of #geoweb Many barriers, but biggest is data quality. Refs to Muki 2010 #geowebchat -11:10 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @peterajohnson Good point. I hadn’t planned a topic for today, so dare we tackle some defns? What IS the #geoweb anyway? #geowebchat -11:13 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mappingmashups Online framework of georefd and discoverable services and data? #Geoweb is the paper on which VGI is drawn. #geowebchat -11:16 AM Jul 26th, 2011


joeeckert Hi gang, Joe Eckert from University of Washington checking in. phd student. http://t.co/vOdlYRR #geowebchat -11:16 AM Jul 26th, 2011


kyamazaki Busy busy. Wish I had more time to join in on the first ever #geowebchat Curious to see how it goes! -11:18 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @peterajohnson So can #VGI exist outside the #Geoweb? Of course, now I require us to define #VGI. #canofworms #geowebchat -11:19 AM Jul 26th, 2011


joeeckert I think geoweb extends beyond online frameworks — must contend with materiality and social network, many offline (VC?) #geoweb #geowebchat -11:19 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mappingmashups Audubon bird count is VGI w/o the Geoweb. This is where CitSci and VGI get confused (for me at least) #geowebchat -11:21 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mhaklay @mappingmashups @peterajohnson shouldn’t #VGI exist outside the web? the original def of VGI included Xmas Bird Count… #geowebchat -11:21 AM Jul 26th, 2011


burnsr77 @peterajohnson @joeeckert maybe amend, to online frameworks etc. + social constructs supporting and enabling? #geowebchat -11:23 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mhaklay nice example! #geowebchat -11:23 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups Hi @kyamazaki. Glad to see a voice from outside the ivory tower. Here’s hoping these chats feel open to “practitioners” too! #geowebchat -11:24 AM Jul 26th, 2011


burnsr77 also very political: devolution of data production enabled through #geoweb #geowebchat -11:24 AM Jul 26th, 2011


joeeckert @mappingmashups @peterajohnson I think that’s where I’m confused too — any diff. between VGI and other times ppl contrib data? #geowebchat -11:24 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @joeeckert well, VGI is UGC w/georefs. #geowebchat Probably should move on from defs = quagmire? -11:26 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @joeeckert (Welcome!) Also an issue: the “web” in “#geoweb“. Does that have to mean www/http/etc or do we interpret it loosely? #geowebchat -11:28 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @burnsr77 You mean devolution from gov’t to citizenry specifically, or all kinds of crowdsourcing of content? #geowebchat -11:29 AM Jul 26th, 2011


joeeckert @mappingmashups I think it serves double duty as a useful metaphor, much like with “network” — concept. structures #geowebchat #geowebchat -11:30 AM Jul 26th, 2011


burnsr77 @mappingmashups definitely both. they’d be useful to separate analytically, but really work by similar logics #geowebchat -11:32 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @burnsr77 love this part of the #geoweb though cuts two ways – citizens as partners but govs cutting back, relying on volunteers #geowebchat -11:32 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mappingmashups @burnsr77 makes me wonder if Web 2.0 is the rebirth of voluntarism in society. 40 years ago volunteers ran a lot #geowebchat -11:34 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @joeeckert I also like using “web” metaphorically. We need some term that can be an umbrella, and can perhaps outlive the “Web”? #geowebchat -11:34 AM Jul 26th, 2011


joeeckert @peterajohnson @burnsr77 justifies researching the social layer as the data itself is shaped by these partnerships #geoewbchat #geowebchat -11:35 AM Jul 26th, 2011


burnsr77 @peterajohnson yep re:”cuts two ways”;but a third way is the opposite: gov’t rolling out in new ways *tips hat to Elwood & Lesz. #geowebchat -11:36 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @joeeckert So the term #geoweb includes geo (which we as geogs care about by defn) and the web/network as concept, but… #geowebchat -11:37 AM Jul 26th, 2011


burnsr77 damn the 140-character limit #geowebchat -11:37 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @burnsr77 good point – rise of alternate governing structures enabled through online communication #geowebchat -11:37 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups …but does not explicitly include soc. structures. A reason why the research group Peter & I are in has yet another term… #geowebchat -11:38 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @burnsr77 it’s awesome, isn’t it? Need to distill to the minimum. #geowebchat -11:38 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mappingmashups oh god, we really have another term? ;) #geowebchat -11:39 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups …which is “the participatory geoweb”. Could argue the same for “Web 2.0″, hence “social web” or “social software” as alts. #geowebchat -11:40 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @peterajohnson you didn’t realize how much I enjoyed wanking about terminology? We only have to do this once! #geowebchat -11:43 AM Jul 26th, 2011


burnsr77 @mappingmashups hmm that’s interesting. i’m with @joeeckert that the geoweb *is* social/participatory & VGI reflects that #geowebchat -11:44 AM Jul 26th, 2011


burnsr77 @mappingmashups not that i disagree with your terminology ;) #geowebchat -11:45 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @peterajohnson @burnsr77 Well, if for no other reason than the 140 char limit (129 w/ hashtag) I’m happy with plain “#geoweb#geowebchat -11:47 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mhaklay Isn’t ‘Participatory GeoWeb’ more about differentiating crowdsourcing (‘exploitative’) from engaged & tranparent forms? #geowebchat -11:48 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mappingmashups wanking is an accurate term! Just don’t make too many boxes yet – and be willing to remake as necessary #geowebchat -11:48 AM Jul 26th, 2011


joeeckert @mhaklay ah, that makes a bit more sense – although that opens the question of whether or not free labor is inherently exploit’n #geowebchat -11:49 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @mhaklay, yes, explicitly drawing from the lit and ethics of #PGIS/#PPGIS. (Almost said “legacy”, but P/PPGIS not dead yet!) #geowebchat -11:51 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mhaklay Agree. Heard term “ambient VGI” used to justify scraping. Love to see move from citizens as sensors to citizen partners #geowebchat -11:52 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @mhaklay Also, though, PGeoweb could distinguish from Geoweb sites that have no particip/crowdsourcing at all. #geowebchat -11:53 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mappingmashups Here is a question – are sites like data.gov part of Geoweb? They provide data, but no participation #geowebchat -11:54 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @peterajohnson @mhaklay Citizen partners sounds a lot like Muki’s “Extreme Citizen Science”? #geowebchat -11:55 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @peterajohnson Tons of the chapters in Scharl & Tochtermann’s seminal “The Geospatial Web” have no participation. #geowebchat -11:57 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mappingmashups @mhaklay we need more real world examples – each Geoweb implementation could have different levels of engagement #geowebchat -11:57 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mhaklay @mappingmashups indeed, it is a deliberate mixture of PGIS and citizen science. #geowebchat -11:57 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups …it’s all just geodata + the modular, interoperable components that were in @timoreilly‘s original Web 2.0 defn. #geowebchat -11:58 AM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @mappingmashups do you think Scharl & T are talking about the same Geoweb we are here? I think they do, but only in a few spots. #geowebchat -11:59 AM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups Well, the hour has flown by! We’ve done a good job of staking out the scope of our ongoing chats & posing some Qs to return to. #geowebchat -12:00 PM Jul 26th, 2011


joeeckert @mappingmashups @peterajohnson @mhaklay @rburns thanks everyone! #geowebchat -12:01 PM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups @peterajohnson I think it’s an earlier vision of the geoweb, and from a diff POV. I don’t want us to have more than one geoweb! #geowebchat -12:02 PM Jul 26th, 2011


peterajohnson @joeeckert @mappingmashups @mhaklay @burnsr77 is #geowebchat trending yet? Maybe next time? Cheers everyone. -12:02 PM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups So, let me know if you have any prefs for future topics. If not, I’ll just pick something that we came up with today. #geowebchat -12:03 PM Jul 26th, 2011


burnsr77 thanks, everyone! same time next week? #geowebchat -12:03 PM Jul 26th, 2011


mappingmashups Also, I need someone else to moderate on Aug 16 and 23. Let me know. And yes, let’s do this again next week! #geowebchat -12:04 PM Jul 26th, 2011


mhaklay @peterajohnson @joeeckert @mappingmashups @burnsr77 thanks for interesting #geowebchat -12:08 PM Jul 26th, 2011

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