#geowebchat transcript, 19 March 2013

@mappingmashups Mar 17, 7:26pm Next #geowebchat: Hackathons, what are they good for? Join us Tues 12pm PDT 3pm EDT 7pm GMT mappingmashups.net/2013/03/17/nex… Please RT!

@mappingmashups 12:01pm Have you ever organized or participated in a #hackathon? Tell us your story! Join the discussion at the hashtag #geowebchat starting now!

@mappingmashups 12:01pm Welcome to #geowebchat everyone. Today we’re talking about #hackathons, #hackdays, #hackfests…

@AngharadStone 12:02pm Good Evening #geowebchat – may I start off with the winner of the recent @envhack winner “Polish off a penguin” penguin.hodgetastic.com/index.html

@markiliffe 12:03pm @mappingmashups we started as a small community and ended up deploying with the Ugandan Government and World Bank #geowebchat

@AndrewShears 12:03pm @mappingmashups I’ve never done any of the above, so I’m a lurker today. #geowebchat

@spara 12:04pm @mappingmashups In my experience, hackathons are good for generating ideas #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:04pm @AngharadStone @envhack Nice “polish off a penguin” project. Good example of the role that designers have in many hackathons #geowebchat

@rob_nason 12:04pm Taking part in my first #geowebchat! Will we start trending this evening!

@re_sieber 12:04pm I participated in #hacktaville, here in Montreal #geowebchat

@uwajibikaji 12:05pm we’ve organized a hack for our SEMA research in Tanzania last year #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:06pm I should also point out that we discussed hackathons in our #geowebchat last month: mappingmashups.net/2013/02/19/geo… Many good critiques raised there.

@richmanmax 12:06pm Loving the idea of a #geowebchat about #hackathons. I’m in!

@bricker 12:06pm what were the outcomes/products? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:06pm BIg problem in #neogeoweb hackathons is diversity of skills. Is that the same in other hackathons? #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:07pm @AndrewShears maybe time to organise one for Fox then?! #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:07pm And here are a few questions to guide the discussion today: mappingmashups.net/2013/03/17/nex… (But we’ve got great momentum already!) #geowebchat

@peterajohnson 12:08pm critique of #hackathons is that they exploit free labour. Isn’t volunteering a choice? Hacking as a recreational activity? #geowebchat

@spara 12:08pm Code for America built two popular apps at our hackathon streetmix.net and click-that-hood.com #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:08pm SEMA hack drew many coders without a clue abour geo #geowebchat

@richmanmax 12:08pm Hope #geowebchat folks have read @jakeporway’s piece in @HarvardBiz on #hackathons: blogs.hbr.org/cs/2013/03/you…

@mappingmashups 12:08pm @re_sieber Is diversity of skills a problem or an advantage in hackathons? #geowebchat

@uwajibikaji 12:09pm @mappingmashups @re_sieber diversity is a benefit, but certain skills are needed otherwise all are swimming #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:09pm How do people feel about large organisation “jumping on the cool bandwagon” of hacckathons? #geowebchat

@richmanmax 12:10pm Last weekend @DataKind put on a #data4good #datadive (problems addressable by data) focused hackathon: bit.ly/DataKingWorldB… #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:10pm @mappingmashups Diversity of skills is a disadvantage. We found many techies frustrated w need to educate non-techies #geowebchat

@spara 12:10pm I don’t think hackathons have to be exclusive events #geowebchat

@peterajohnson 12:10pm People have volunteered their time for generations. Hackathons are just another version of mowing the community soccer field #geowebchat

@CraigMDalton 12:11pm #geowebchat the article seems very means-ends oriented. In my experience the value of hackathons is often building social capital

@eknalprev 12:11pm @re_sieber @mappingmashups diversity can suck if specific output is required #geowebchat

@richmanmax 12:11pm @richmanmax @DataKind er, that should be bit.ly/DataKindWorldB… (no such thing as a DataKing… at least yet…) #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:11pm @uwajibikaji @mappingmashups Diversity of skills is a mgt prob for hackathons where most want to code #geowebchat

@spara 12:11pm @re_sieber @mappingmashups You have to manage the diversity to get everyone to participate #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:11pm @CraigMDalton what about building strength and links within a community? #geowebchat

@CraigMDalton 12:12pm #geowebchat perhaps I’m too inclusive– when is a hackathon a hackathon? vs. a bar camp or conference?

@bricker 12:12pm @peterajohnson only sometimes the outcomes of a hackathon are less useful than a mowed soccer field #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:12pm @markiliffe @CraigMDalton this is a pro thing in the @re_sieber argument agains diversity. communities are diversity #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:13pm @re_sieber but sometimes you need input of non-techies for new ideas and a better understanding of use over flashly tech #geowebchat #hacks

@re_sieber 12:13pm @CraigMDalton is a hackathon an end or a means? I found that many were frustrated that mtg didn’t incorporate followup #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:13pm @CraigMDalton “building social capital” cuts a few ways, too. In the prev chat @tmcw said hackathons are often publicity stunts #geowebchat

@CraigMDalton 12:13pm @markiliffe #geowebchat exactly- building a community

@mpmckenna8 12:13pm @eknalprev @re_sieber @mappingmashups Diversity could increase the likelihood of post hackathon development. Increasing reach… #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:14pm @CraigMDalton – @taarifa_org has used hackathons pretty much exclusively to build its community. #geowebchat

@peterajohnson 12:14pm You all seem to have very lofty goals for a hackathon. Can’t people just get together and NOT change the world for once? #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:14pm @CraigMDalton it also allows @taarifa_org to get critic from others in the field at the problem statement levels. #geowebchat

@uwajibikaji 12:14pm @peterajohnson usually they don’t. biggest problem with hackathons is follow-up #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:15pm @AngharadStone Found that in hackathon most enjoyable session was how to mk best use of a bar chart–data viz writ small #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:15pm @CraigMDalton the idea being that it’s a solution to issues, not a solution in search of a problem #geowebchat

@peterajohnson 12:16pm hackathons = entertainment, recreation, fun, and yes, community building and maybe even creating a useful app to find kale #geowebchat

@spara 12:16pm Follow-up is the responsibility of the team. For example @chipr used a hackathon a base for Knight Grant response #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:17pm @CraigMDalton @markiliffe @re_sieber diversity is good when it involves communities, but can be a problem for coding output #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:17pm @peterajohnson What’s the goal of a specific hackathon? Many go to play w code, although lofty goals are often motivations too #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:17pm @eknalprev isn’t a very deterministic approach in that #hackathons are always about code? #geowebchat @CraigMDalton @re_sieber

@uwajibikaji 12:18pm @markiliffe @eknalprev @CraigMDalton @re_sieber but is the code a means or an end ? #geowebchat

@peterajohnson 12:19pm @re_sieber so is there much of a difference between a hackathon and various other community development activities? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:19pm @eknalprev @CraigMDalton @markiliffe How does a hackathon differ from a participatory GIS session? R we just rebranding PPGIS? #geowebchat

@spara 12:19pm re diversity. Most people show up to contribute, lack of coding skills is not a reason. Take advantage of their knowledge #geowebchat

@peterajohnson 12:19pm @uwajibikaji code is an end in itself + a means to an end. Depends on individual. #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:20pm As community v’s tech seems to be an issue – would any consider doing a hack in 2 parts? ideas then coding just for the techies? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:20pm @uwajibikaji @markiliffe @eknalprev @CraigMDalton For many, code is the beginning & end, amen #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:20pm @re_sieber @peterajohnson to me hackatons are also education #geowebchat

@spara 12:20pm Code is both a means and an end. The group decides. #geowebchat

@GrahamHyde 12:20pm If a large organisation wants to jump on any bandwagon doesn’t that validate what you are doing? # hack #geowebchat @AngharadStone

@tmcw 12:21pm @re_sieber @eknalprev @CraigMDalton @markiliffe PPGIS needs a rebrand (or to die as a term), but hackathons aren’t that #geowebchat

@GrahamHyde 12:22pm A learning #hack will be part of #bigdataweek in Leeds at end of April #geowebchat

@CraigMDalton 12:22pm @re_sieber the one at the AAG last year? yes- on follow up. Could #geowebchat ‘s growth could be seen as a form of follow up to that?

@eknalprev 12:22pm @tmcw @re_sieber @CraigMDalton @markiliffe similarity ends with good facilitation? #geowebchat

@richmanmax 12:22pm Okay #geowebchat #overlyhonestmethods: I usually make some sort of map at #hackathons so we all can look at something pretty at the end.

@re_sieber 12:23pm @eknalprev @peterajohnson If hackathons are also ab educ then educ ab what? If not tech then isn’t this still just comn dev #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:23pm @richmanmax Those are the #overlyhonestmethods for #PPGIS, too. #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:23pm @GrahamHyde I’m concerned about org holding #hacks just to be seen to be on trend but not doing anything with the outcomes #geowebchat

@peterajohnson 12:23pm Can’t we just replace the term ‘hackathon’ with ‘workshop’? #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:24pm @re_sieber @peterajohnson in our case educating non-geo coders about the joy of geoweb :-) #geowebchat

@greerjacob 12:24pm Hackathons are an additional type of event model. Motivation, goal, participants, method… these are always organizing problems. #geowebchat

@bricker 12:24pm @tmcw why should PPGIS die? cost? not sexy enough in these modern times? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:24pm @tmcw @eknalprev @CraigMDalton @markiliffe NEVER! ;-) #PPGISforever #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:24pm @peterajohnson “workshop” to me suggests more facilitation. Also implies that the event itself is the goal, not a product. #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:25pm @CraigMDalton What then r hackathons? Comm dev+edu+tech in playful surrouds? #geowebchat

@CraigMDalton 12:25pm @re_sieber @eknalprev @markiliffe #geowebchat It seems that a hackathon is a short term tactic. ?PPGIS long term, thoughtful project?

@mappingmashups 12:25pm @peterajohnson …so maybe yes, some hackathons should be called workshops, but not all. #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:25pm MT @mappingmashups:”workshop” to me suggests more facilitation. Implies that the event itself is the goal, not a product. #geowebchat +1

@spara 12:25pm @peterajohnson Workshop suggest pedagogy rather than creativity #geowebchat

@mikedotonline 12:25pm @re_sieber Is PPGIS about generation of data and driving participation, whereas hackathons are more about code generation? #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:25pm @mappingmashups @peterajohnson “workshop”— YAWN — went to code at starbucks … #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:26pm “hackathon” does seem to be used broadly… sometimes a workshop, sometimes an unconference, sometimes like PPGIS? #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:26pm @mappingmashups so we need a definition of terms? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:26pm @eknalprev @tmcw @CraigMDalton @markiliffe Sim of skills ends in easier facilitation of hackathon #geowebchat

@mikedotonline 12:26pm do hackathons have to be done in the same physical space, does ppgis? is that how ppgis becomes vgi? #geowebchat

@tmcw 12:26pm @re_sieber @eknalprev @CraigMDalton @markiliffe PPGIS is what academics and bad wikipedia articles call open data #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:27pm RT @markiliffe: @CraigMDalton what about those projects which start at hackathons and are broader than a specific community? #geowebchat

@spara 12:28pm + 1 @tmcw: @re_sieber @eknalprev @CraigMDalton @markiliffe PPGIS is what academics and bad wikipedia articles call open data #geowebchat

@tmcw 12:28pm @mikedotonline Isn’t VGI just a nice term for stealing under the guise of collaboration? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:28pm @mikedotonline PPGIS=participation; hackathons=code. That’s what I’m wondering. Even in hackathons, coders want to do good #geowebchat

@spara 12:29pm @mappingmashups @markiliffe @CraigMDalton reuse is a desired outcome #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:29pm @spara the world just doesn’t need another reporting platform. Unless it’s written in Haskell. #geowebchat /cc @mappingmashups @CraigMDalton

@CraigMDalton 12:30pm @re_sieber #geowebchat in-person collaborative code? a subculture/tribe event? thus my question earlier what is a hackathon?

@spara 12:30pm @re_sieber @mikedotonline Hackthons are more than code. They can be ideas and process #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:30pm RT @spara: @re_sieber @mikedotonline Hackthons are more than code. They can be ideas and process #geowebchat <— YES! +1

@mizmay 12:30pm As someone who works within gov’t doing data viz, hackathons for social change are a tiny bit antagonizing. #geowebchat

@peterajohnson 12:30pm I bring up alternate term because hype behind something can be stripped away by using a simpler term with a longer history #geowebchat

@mikedotonline 12:31pm @re_sieber hackathons are about doing good? I always thought they were about doing “cool”. #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:31pm @mizmay can you elaborate? #geowebchat

@disruptivegeo 12:31pm @spara @tmcw @re_sieber @eknalprev @CraigMDalton @markiliffe In its defense, there is “process” to PPGIS beyond the data #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:31pm @markiliffe We need a definition of terms and the definition should be added here: geoweb.andrewshears.com/index.php?titl… #geowebchat #geowebwiki

@spara 12:31pm Hackathons are a way of looking at problems and finding solutions outside of regular process #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:32pm RT @mizmay: As someone who works within gov’t doing data viz, hackathons for social change are a tiny bit antagonizing. #geowebchat – AGREED

@eknalprev 12:32pm @disruptivegeo @spara @tmcw @re_sieber @CraigMDalton @markiliffe indeed, in many cases there is no beyond to hackathons #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:32pm @CraigMDalton YES. Physicality and collaboration v important to hackathons #geowebchat. also comfort in the tribe (as you said, see AAG)

@mizmay 12:33pm “Learning to test and clean the data is still… a skill that a data visualizer needs.” bit.ly/117Mai3 #geowebchat

@spara 12:33pm @eknalprev @disruptivegeo @tmcw @re_sieber @CraigMDalton @markiliffe Fail fast still applies. #geowebchat

@vijaybarve 12:33pm @mikedotonline Hackthons are dong cool good may be #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:34pm @markiliffe @mizmay For me the idea’s aren’t nessessarily new of different from what we’ve been trying to do but without freedom #geowebchat

@spara 12:34pm @mizmay If the people holding a hackathon want usable code, they must bring clean data #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:35pm To some, hackathons are a retreat from the messiness of democracy. “We code therefore we fix the wicked problems” #geowebchat

@mikedotonline 12:35pm can hackathons also be a way of personal exposure and corporate responsibility? Consider Google’s women in code initative #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:35pm @spara @mizmay but is data is already “sanitized” and objectives set, then where’s the innovation? #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:35pm @spara does a #hackathon always have to involve data? @mizmay #geowebchat

@counti8 12:36pm re: PPGIS & hackathons: PPGIS (mostly) doesn’t emphasize civic tech ownership; hackathons value expertise expressed in code. #geowebchat

@mizmay 12:37pm @markiliffe Sure. First, it’s the emphasis on the sleek product, rather than the thoughtful, genuine insight #geowebchat

@counti8 12:37pm @re_sieber IAWTC. My policy wonkiness laments the underemphasis on domain knowledge expressed in hackathons. #geowebchat

@andnewmanGEO 12:37pm I have never been to a hackathon – that makes me cool right? and as I can write MapBasic that makes MapBasic cool too. #geowebchat

@spara 12:37pm @eknalprev @mizmay Innovation is in the solution, not the data munging #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:38pm @markiliffe @spara @mizmay Some hackathons are as much about hacking/cleaning data as creating software. Esp for crisis mapping. #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:38pm @counti8 Disagree. My earliest wk was precisely ab civic tech ownership, even though it was bulky GISs. #geowebchat

@spara 12:39pm @mappingmashups @markiliffe @mizmay True, that can be one function of a hackathong #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:39pm @counti8 Interesting Q, do ppl now own tech, if it’s Google API suite? Are hackathons expressions of ownership over tech? #geowebchat

@counti8 12:40pm Hackathons excite me in combo w/ code.org. Want to dodge issue reductionism & support diversity of participants. #geowebchat

@disruptivegeo 12:41pm Exactly. RT “@spara: @eknalprev @mizmay Innovation is in the solution, not the data munging #geowebchat”

@markiliffe 12:41pm @mizmay doesn’t that come down to leadership at the #hackathon though? I’m really interested in your experiences! #geowebchat

@counti8 12:41pm @re_sieber Is that ownership in the open source understanding of tech, i.e. you can choose how to share this data, manip, etc.? #geowebchat

@mikedotonline 12:41pm @re_sieber what that make corporate sponsored hackathons subversive? #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:41pm @re_sieber @counti8 oh dear, the ownership issue. Wonder what @ppgis has to say about this #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:42pm @spara @mappingmashups @markiliffe @mizmay Did you mean hackathon or hackathong? Got to get me one of the latter #geowebchat

@andnewmanGEO 12:42pm But seriously hack days let you learn new skills or contribute to products. #geowebchat

@mizmay 12:42pm @markiliffe and second there is the assumption that tech is efficient and government is inefficient #geowebchat

@GrahamHyde 12:42pm For info. bigdataweek.com/bigdatachallen… #geowebchat

@mpmckenna8 12:42pm An interesting hackathon and civic hacking requirement for hacks has been they must go beyond putting data on a map. #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:42pm @re_sieber I’m wearing one right now… #geowebchat /cc @spara @mappingmashups @mizmay

@spara 12:43pm @re_sieber @mappingmashups @markiliffe @mizmay Hah! Freudian slip! #geowebchat

@mpmckenna8 12:44pm @andnewmanGEO And hackthons give you exposure to others skills and strategies you may not have conceived of. #geowebchat

@spara 12:44pm @markiliffe @re_sieber @mappingmashups @mizmay damn Pythong #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:44pm How do we all feel about the logistics and facilitation of a #hackathon? Problem statements, needs? What makes a good one? #geowebchat

@counti8 12:44pm @eknalprev Likely @re_sieber are using the word diff. Many layers to it. I’m curious re: post-hack/PPGIS session indiv work. #geowebchat

@mizmay 12:45pm @markiliffe When in truth, social issues tend to involve entrenched systems with deep roots and people in the trenches… #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:45pm @GrahamHyde First we had #opendataday and now #bigdataweek. Because #bigdata is too big for one day! #geowebchat #odhd

@richmanmax 12:45pm .@mizmay I’m also a social sector “intrapreneuer” & certain hackathons have been great to meet & learn from super smart folks. #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:45pm @mizmay @markiliffe @mikedotonline We shoud not ignore the instrusion of the market, capital accum, outsourcing in a hackathon #geowebchat

@mikedotonline 12:45pm @spara, I bet its constrictive. #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:46pm @API_Economics problem statements for… #geowebchat

@spara 12:46pm @markiliffe I let the participants decide on problem statements, then let them sort them into working topics. #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:47pm RT @markiliffe: How do we all feel about the logistics and facilitation of a #hackathon? What makes a good one? #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:47pm @spara @markiliffe Hackathon organizers need to recognize the range of types we’ve identified, and outline what they expect. #geowebchat

@mizmay 12:47pm @richmanmax that’s legit, hackathons are good social networking… #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:48pm @spara @markiliffe Some organizers may want a free-for-all, while others hope for more focus. Vols need to know what to expect. #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:48pm @counti8 @eknalprev PPGIS emphasizes empowerment (may or may not occur). Does participation in hackathons provide empowerment? #geowebchat

@richmanmax 12:48pm .@mizmay @markiliffe with the right kind of volunteer event, perhaps it can help persuade folks to join us in the trenches? #geowebchat

@lolkins 12:48pm @markiliffe I’d be unsure of what skills I can bring to the table. I’d thus like ones that are explicit in their objectives. #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:49pm @re_sieber @counti8 good question. will take it to our next workshop. #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:49pm @lolkins that (IMHO) makes you the most valuable participant. I find that hackers can get bogged down in detail …(tbc) #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:50pm @lolkins having people to support and require explanation forces documentation to occur, making the #hackathon more sustainable #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:51pm @mappingmashups @spara @markiliffe Is there code of ethics 4hackathon? 1.organizers must anticipate skill-levels & offer feedbk #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:51pm @markiliffe @lolkins another big argument to have skills diversity in a hackathon #geowebchat

@mikedotonline 12:51pm @re_sieber are all participants equal? coding experience and ability will vary greatly, and influence participation #geowebchat

@counti8 12:51pm @re_sieber No argument from me re: skepticism at empowerment at hackathons; they come pre-loaded w/ assump’s. #geowebchat @eknalprev

@andnewmanGEO 12:51pm @lolkins @markiliffe agreed I have loads of ideas but my technical skills are depreciating, should I go. #Geowebchat

@spara 12:52pm @re_sieber @mappingmashups @markiliffe There are guides for running a hackathon. @codeforamerica has one #geowebchat

@eknalprev 12:52pm @re_sieber @mappingmashups @spara @markiliffe theres a nice report about the succesfactors in the waterhackathons #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:52pm @andnewmanGEO coders shouldn’t be the only participants, you need facilitators, documenters, testers, leaders etc. #geowebchat /cc @lolkins

@re_sieber 12:53pm @mikedotonline One of the probs: not all participants equal (&therefore valued) in hackathons #geowebchat #codersRule

@eknalprev 12:53pm RT @eknalprev: @re_sieber @mappingmashups @spara @markiliffe succesfactors in the waterhackathons waterhackathon.org #geowebchat

@andnewmanGEO 12:53pm @markiliffe @lolkins organisers need to be clear on this in invites then! #geowebchat

@mikedotonline 12:54pm @re_sieber, analogous to PPGIS, value of Elders vs. Youth opinion #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:55pm @spara Do you have a link to that #cfa guide? #geowebchat

@markiliffe 12:55pm @mizmay to play devils advocate, you could say at #hackathons they present themselves that way…? #geowebchat /cc @richmanmax @re_sesper

@mizmay 12:55pm @markiliffe @richmanmax @re_sesper hackathons often treat gov’t/social agencies like black boxes. that cuts both ways. #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:55pm RT @andnewmanGEO :
@markiliffe @lolkins organisers need to be clear on this in invites then! #geowebchat > many only ask for coders!

@re_sieber 12:57pm @andnewmanGEO @markiliffe @lolkins Do we run risk of inviting deserving not undeserving particips in hackathons?Sim prob w PPGIS #geowebchat

@spara 12:58pm @mappingmashups @codeforamerica Event Guide google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j… #geowebchat

@counti8 12:58pm @eknalprev @re_sieber IMHO, hackathons stress ownership in a practical, I’ll-leave&improve-this sense. (Speak to data type too.) #geowebchat

@mizmay 12:58pm @markiliffe sorry, lost the thread. present themselves what way? #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:59pm @re_sieber @andnewmanGEO @markiliffe @lolkins I was put off a recent hack as you had to register so they could vet applicates! #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 1:00pm RT @re_sieber: @spara @mappingmashups @codeforamerica Very useful taxonomy for hackathon like events docs.google.com/document/d/16C… #geowebchat

@mizmay 1:00pm I’d be curious to hear from folks who participated in a successful #hackathon for social change, and what that constituted #geowebchat

@spara 1:00pm @re_sieber @mappingmashups @codeforamerica It’s part of our training as CfA Fellows #geowebchat

@markiliffe 1:01pm @mizmay as governments/orgs presenting themselves as black boxes #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 1:01pm We’ve hit the end of our hour at #geowebchat. Please continue chatting if you like. I will post a transcript here: mappingmashups.net/geowebchat/

@re_sieber 1:01pm @counti8 @eknalprev So hackathons embed the feedback? “I own this code, analysis, viz so I’ll find ways to further develop it?” #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 1:02pm Also, please take a moment to add your thoughts to #hackathon page at the #geowebwiki: geoweb.andrewshears.com/index.php?titl… #geowebchat

@markiliffe 1:02pm @mappingmashups boo! #geowebchat

@mizmay 1:02pm @richmanmax @markiliffe yes, goint in the trenches/wanting to delve deeper into an issue would constitute success to my mind #geowebchat

@richmanmax 1:02pm .@mappingmashups thanks for organizing. enjoyed the #geowebchat

@spara 1:02pm @mizmay This grant proposal is the product of a hackathong newschallenge.org/profiles/chip/ #geowebchat

@re_sieber 1:02pm @AngharadStone @andnewmanGEO @markiliffe @lolkins Hackathons, the new members-only treehouse where only the cool kids hang out #geowebchat

@markiliffe 1:03pm @spara I propose we rename hackathons to hackathongs! #geowebchat /cc @mizmay

@mizmay 1:03pm @markiliffe because they won’t clarify? or can’t? or aren’t there? #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 1:03pm If you liked this topic, we can continue the chat in a subsequent #geowebchat. Upcoming chat topics: #drones on Apr2, #AAG2013 debrief Apr16

@spara 1:03pm @markiliffe @mizmay I don’t know what’s wrong with my typing today! #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 1:04pm And as always I’m looking for #geowebchat guest hosts and topic suggestions. Don’t be shy! I need help keeping this going.

@spara 1:04pm @re_sieber @AngharadStone @andnewmanGEO @markiliffe @lolkins Not true, it depends on how you run the event #geowebchat

@re_sieber 1:05pm @markiliffe @mizmay Gov cont to present itself as blackbox in hackathon & not tkg adv of openness is missed opport for gov #geowebchat

@counti8 1:06pm @re_sieber @eknalprev Def. encourages self-org on long-term maintenance in assumed absence of formal sanctioned app stewardship #geowebchat

@spara 1:06pm Pics from the recent Code Across America flickr.com/search/?q=%23c… #geowebchat

@eknalprev 1:06pm @mappingmashups thanks for hosting this frenzy #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 1:06pm And thanks to all the new people who joined this #geowebchat. It’s been intense!

@mizmay 1:07pm @re_sieber @markiliffe I think the “black box” comes down to communication failures due to differences in social/culture #geowebchat

@re_sieber 1:08pm @counti8 @eknalprev Continuing the spirit of the hackathon long after its end should be important obj #geowebchat

@andnewmanGEO 1:09pm So how about ‘do days’ predefined problem & a day 2 find & try sols 2 bring strategists, practitioners, users & coders 2gether. #geowebchat

@mizmay 1:09pm @re_sieber @markiliffe … and #hackathons are tech culture. Can you ask gov’t to meet you there? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 1:10pm @mizmay @markiliffe Perhaps hackathon is one way to break blackbox w gov coders communing w civil soc coders. #geowebchat

@DavidBuckster 1:10pm So reading #geowebchat @andnewmanGEO @AngharadStone yours skills as #geo mentors for @youngrewired would always be appreciated.

@re_sieber 1:10pm Love to have #geowebchat meetup at AAG in LA

@mizmay 1:11pm @re_sieber I’ll be there #geowebchat

@eknalprev 1:11pm RT @re_sieber: Love to have #geowebchat meetup at AAG in LA: Count me in

@spara 1:11pm @mizmay @re_sieber @markiliffe We have government participate all the time #geowebchat

@eknalprev 1:13pm @re_sieber lets have it at the beach so we can all wear our hackathongs #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 1:14pm @re_sieber Can we set-up a skype for those too far away at attend #AAG ? #GeoWebChat

@mizmay 1:14pm @spara @re_sieber @markiliffe yes, gov’t participates. on your terms. I’m just saying that has disadvantages. #geowebchat

@re_sieber 1:14pm @spara @mizmay @markiliffe “We have government participate all the time” #geowebchat Another way to us v them–gov as participants too

@spara 1:14pm @mizmay @re_sieber @markiliffe Gov participates on their terms, they bring knowledge and data crucial to success #geowebchat

@mizmay 1:15pm @AngharadStone haha this is getting advanced @re_sieber let’s do it. #AAG #geowebchat

@re_sieber 1:16pm @eknalprev If I made a hackathong (to sell 4cheap, not to show!), I’d need a slogan and how many might want one. #geowebchat

@spara 1:16pm @re_sieber @mizmay @markiliffe We acknowledge gov has critical knowledge of process and problem. We welcome their contributions #geowebchat

@re_sieber 1:17pm @mizmay @AngharadStone Stay tuned fo details of meetup (&skype address) of #geowebchat @aag

@spara 1:17pm @mizmay @AngharadStone @re_sieber Hah, this might convince me to break my 21 year boycott of the AAG #geowebchat

@markiliffe 1:19pm @QuentinJohns1 have a look at #geowebchat stream! :)

@re_sieber 1:21pm @spara Come to AAG. We can talk Neal Stephenson and William Gibson. Plus #geowebchat

@QuentinJohns1 1:29pm @markiliffe 4 viable solutions 1.clearly defined problem statement (crowd sourced from relevant users / providers / experts) #geowebchat

@QuentinJohns1 1:29pm @markiliffe 2. right mix of subject experts / Devs (30/70 roughly) with facilitators available #geowebchat

@QuentinJohns1 1:30pm @markiliffe 3. Documentation with a clear line to incubation and support afterwards 4 successes #geowebchat

@QuentinJohns1 1:37pm “@markiliffe blogs.hbr.org/cs/2013/03/you… @jakeporway great article on hack design (I’m sure it’s posted here somewhere) #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 1:37pm @re_sieber Presumably someone will organize a general #AAG2013 tweetup. We can also do one specifically for #geowebchat if we want. Why not?

@mappingmashups 1:40pm I also hope to see the #geowebchat crowd at @floating_sheep’s #AAG2013 #ironsheep event. Assuming no “tribal” scheduling conflict like 2012.

@QuentinJohns1 1:40pm #geowebchat what if gov defined entrepreneurial gaps in the (social & environmental) markets… Then hacked 4 ideas? @markiliffe

@mappingmashups 1:44pm .@spara @floating_sheep The #ironsheep “hackathon” will be in the evening of Wed April 10. Location still TBD, I think? #AAG2013 #geowebchat

@mizmay 2:12pm @spara @re_sieber @markiliffe see you at @aag? In the meantime… gov’t is not a monolith and the culture is hierarchical. #geowebchat

@mizmay 5:55pm @spara #CampaignFinance is a fantastic example of where data viz for social change is sorely needed, thanks! #geowebchat

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