Next #geowebchat, March 18: Paid Contributions in #OpenData Projects with guest host @mpmckenna8

The next #geowebchat will be on Tuesday, March 18 for one hour, starting at 12pm PDT, 3pm EDT, 7pm GMT. (Note the time change due to Daylight Savings Time in the US)

[Guest post: reposted from Matthew McKenna's blog]

The World Wide Web was conceptualized at CERN to help scientists collaborate on a project in which a bunch of people had to share a lot of information to try to make sense of it.  Since then, I’d argue the internet’s main contribution to humanity is the ability of almost anyone to access or share amounts of data at a scale that only science fiction writers would have imagined 50 years ago.

Wikipedia, which is part of the Wikimedia Foundation, is one of the best examples of a tricky collaborative data project and it has faced a lot of hurdles to gain the acceptance it enjoys today. Likely the biggest detractor to Wikipedia is special interest editors who are pushing a certain view because if others adopt that view they think they will benefit financially. For this reason Wikimedia is amending their terms of use with the reasons being given on the following page:

Maybe other collaborative data projects should consider something similar?

I’d like to pick up my editing game on Wikimedia (in a voluntary capacity), but lately I’ve been spending more time on the collaborative mapping project OpenStreetMap (OSM).  The community around it is great, but at times it seems like the map is driven by people with financial interests in it.  With many of the edits in areas I’ve looked at coming from employees of companies (such as Mapbox) making use of OSM data.  Most of the time it’s even posted in the User Profile that the given user works for the given company and there should be even more people who depend on the quality of OSM data.

Along with the highest number of contributions of edits coming from people with a financial interest in OSM I’ve also seen the highest number of edits which hurt the quality of the map and its data. That’s not to say that intentions aren’t usually good, but if I wasn’t good at complaining on social media and Mapbox staff ignored me I’d probably be done helping OpenStreetMap and would feel as inclined to use Google MapMaker.

I hope this #GeoWebChat can transcend just geo a bit and discuss what happens as collaborative data projects on the internet go from mostly volunteerism to having dollar driven interests also involved.

I’d especially like to hear experiences either as a paid helper of OSM (they’ve made a lot of the map possible and even more usable) or a volunteer who feels it’s just not an accessible community for beginners. Or people who think beginners might just use Google MapMaker at this point.

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#geowebchat transcript: 4 March 2014: Favorite maps, favorite apps #favemapfaveapp

@re_sieber Mar 02, 11:18pm .@mappingmashups if you have no topic; the #geowebchat could be my fave map; my fave app. #paleogo & #neogeo

@mappingmashups Mar 03, 12:23pm Tomorrow on #geowebchat: share your favorite map and/or map app! Join us, Tuesday March 4, 12pm PST #favemapfaveapp

@re_sieber Mar 03, 8:11pm To jumpstart #favemapfaveapp on #geowebchat: 22 Maps That Explain The Centuries-Long Conflict In Ukraine…

@mappingmashups Mar 04, 11:01am On #geowebchat, we’re sharing our fave maps of all time. What’s on your “desert island” map playlist? Join today at noon! #favemapfaveapp

@mappingmashups Mar 04, 11:03am I’ll pick @enf’s Locals and Tourists maps as among my favorites of all time:… #geowebchat

@mappingmashups Mar 04, 11:04am .@enf’s Locals & Tourists maps are not only beautiful, but they also tell us so much about cities and how people use them. #geowebchat

@mappingmashups Mar 04, 11:07am Also @enf’s twist to deduce Locals/Tourists from patterns not visible at first. Differentiates from other social media maps. #geowebchat

@mappingmashups Mar 04, 11:09am I feel like I could teach a whole class about urbanism and about social media using nothing but…. #geowebchat

@mappingmashups Mar 04, 11:11am Tweet your #favemap/#faveapp during #geowebchat today, and tell us _why_ they’re your favorite! Will post summary at

@marisagreen Mar 04, 11:20am @mappingmashups I don’t have just one #favemap – I have a whole Pinterest board:… #geowebchat

@evanlandman Mar 04, 11:26am I love #favemap #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 11:52am @marisagreen Fabulous counter-pinning: RT I don’t have just one #favemap – I have a whole Pinterest board… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 11:59am My #favemap: Minard’s map of Napoleon’s disastrous march to Russia. Concise, hi dens info, comprehensible #geowebchat…

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:01pm Start the tweeting: #myfavemapmyfaveapp #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:03pm #myfaveapp is actually the suite of tools @ #geowebchat

@sidewalkballet Mar 04, 12:03pm @re_sieber Here’s some revisions of Minard’s map… #geowebchat

@skorasaurus Mar 04, 12:05pm @tilemill / beautiful web maps / free / open-source / responsive, friendly devs / great docs / #myfaveapp #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:05pm .@sidewalkballet And… doesn’t try to distort (eg w georegistration) the beauty of the map #geowebchat

@SeanGorman Mar 04, 12:06pm @re_sieber here is a fun interactive version of Minard’s map… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:08pm Books containing #myfavemap Else/Where, You are Here. Maps don’t have to be georegistered or be warped to fit Google Earth #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:14pm #myfavemap or is it #myfaveapp (paleo edition) polynesian navigation charts… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:14pm #myfavemap book Chief Kerry’s Moose: A Guidebook to Land Use and Occupancy Mapping, Research Design and Data Collection #geowebchat

@sidewalkballet Mar 04, 12:16pm One of some #myfavemap: identical place names across America — not many unique names, it seems #geowebchat

@skorasaurus Mar 04, 12:17pm it’s hard to keep all of those great maps that I Find organized: I have them on @Pinboard , local bookmarks, evernote, #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:18pm #myfavemap (well, GIS data): The Middle Earth Digital Elevation Model Project #geowebchat

@mjfoster83 Mar 04, 12:20pm I second the vote for @tilemill. Great, useful application. #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:20pm @skorasaurus @Pinboard @marisagreen Great idea to pin #myfavemap s (And, given pushpins, also recursive!) #geowebchat

@skorasaurus Mar 04, 12:21pm wondering if #geowebchat is a little quiet today b/c: we’re all doing taxes and staring in awe at others’ maps.

@MapHugger Mar 04, 12:22pm #geowebchat I’ve already written a whole essay on #myfavemap :…

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:24pm How about map couture w these fab historical map dresses? #geowebchat

@erictheise Mar 04, 12:27pm don’t have a favorite map/app to share but did you know phone mapping while driving was ruled ok in cali? #geowebchat

@sidewalkballet Mar 04, 12:29pm I spy one of these… on those map dresses–maybe not maps, but I dig ‘em regardless. #myfavemap #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:30pm .@erictheise there has to be a recursion joke somewhere in phone mapping while driving:”But I was “watching” the road, officer!” #geowebchat

@erictheise Mar 04, 12:33pm the phone is not the territory, @re_sieber #geowebchat

@mjfoster83 Mar 04, 12:35pm they arent beacons of design, but ive always had a strange affinity for the USGS quads, especially early 20th century versions #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:42pm @mjfoster83 I love UK Ord Survey Maps. Incredible detail; makes you feel you can find the smallest details. I still get lost #geowebchat

@pinakographos Mar 04, 12:45pm #geowebchat I wrote a review of #myfavemap in CP (@NACIS_CP):…

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:45pm No votes for waze or foursquare for #myfaveapp? #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:47pm @pinakographos @NACIS_CP That’s a great review & a beautiful map #geowebchat

@sidewalkballet Mar 04, 12:52pm @re_sieber eh I think waze is kinda ugly despite having some good features, usually just use traffic in googlemaps #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:54pm Some of #myfaveapp s are location guessing games like and #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:56pm Never got into geocaching but friends really like #myfaveapp #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 12:58pm Any last #myfavemap s, #myfaveapp s? #geowebchat

@erictheise Mar 04, 1:00pm most of my favorite maps are on paper (in flat files). always loved the grande randonnée hiking map of france #geowebchat

@re_sieber Mar 04, 1:00pm Thanks everyone for today’s #geowebchat on #myfavemap, #myfaveapp. Small but fun. Pls continue to tweet, pin your maps&apps.

@kennethfield Mar 04, 1:02pm During 2014 we’re doing a daily blog of ‘favourites’ at the ICA Map Design site #geowebchat

@sidewalkballet Mar 04, 1:03pm #myfavemap is a heavily annotated, worn and torn paper road map #nostalgia #roadtrip #geowebchat

@mattdance Mar 04, 1:58pm If we’re getting all nostalgic. 1:50000 NTS maps of Ontario with canoe routes & other annotations added. #geowebchat #frenchriver

@mattdance Mar 05, 1:27pm Fellow GeoNerds. If you have not done so already, check out #geowebchat to see some #favemap posts. Nice selection of work.

@re_sieber Mar 05, 4:45pm SimCity strictly for transit geeks: Build your own subway system… #myfaveapp #geowebchat

@michael_d_gould Mar 06, 12:04am #myfavapp #geowebchat Flightaware allows search by aircraft, so all the B777-300ERs:…

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#geowebchat transcript: 18 February 2014: the geography of #lifelogging

@mappingmashups Feb 12, 3:01pm @re_sieber So, should I put “the geoweb and lifelogging” on the #geowebchat calendar for Feb 18?

@re_sieber Feb 12, 6:15pm @mappingmashups sure, why not lifelogging? #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 12, 6:19pm To get a good perspective on the future of lifelogging, read the #sf novel, The Light of Other Days… #geowebchat

@mappingmashups Feb 12, 7:05pm First #sf novel assigned as #geowebchat reading: MT @re_sieber: the future of lifelogging: The Light of Other Days…

@re_sieber Feb 12, 7:24pm Lifelogging=documenting the minutia of your life + the cloud. Pogue says be wary of the latter… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 12, 7:25pm Lifelogging: if you keep your life on the cloud, what happens when your life gets the blue screen of death? #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 12, 7:27pm What’s the Clippy version of fitbit? “It looks like you’re having a heart attack”? #lifelogging #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 12, 7:28pm Is a lifelogged on the cloud, life on a leash?… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 12, 7:31pm Interesting tension btwn the performative (instagram what I eat) & the real (fitbit) in lifelogging. Can’t easily fake heartrate #geowebchat

@razsc Feb 13, 9:10am @re_sieber Yes! Also, this:… #geowebchat

@mappingmashups Feb 13, 12:17pm RT @spara: Another case for life logging #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 13, 1:38pm Just in time for our #geowebchat on #lifelogging: 10 things you need to know about lifelogging…

@re_sieber Feb 13, 1:42pm What lifelogging looks like in an infographic… #geowebchat Is it just me or is this #TMI?

@anabrandusescu Feb 13, 1:52pm @re_sieber tmi. voluntary participation in this level of tracking/surveillance is beyond me #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 13, 2:01pm Another technology for #lifelogging: the narrative clip. Time+location+photos @ regular intervals… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 13, 2:09pm Lifelogging”creates generatn gap btwn those w blinds closed &those w glass house who play catch w stones”… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 13, 2:59pm .@steveliang you should bring your expertise on the Internet of Things to our #geowebchat on #lifelogging Tues, 1pm MT

@re_sieber Feb 13, 3:24pm Can’t talk about #lifelogging without referring to one of its pioneers–Steve Mann… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 13, 5:27pm In preparation for Tues #geowebchat on #lifelogging & yet another excuse for #sf, participants could watch Star Trek, S4E11 Data’s Day

@re_sieber Feb 13, 10:27pm A new app for #lifelogging, or rather the quantified self mvmt: bellabeat… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 14, 12:09am If we can retain real memories w #lifelogging what ab false memories? See #sf Total Recall or We Can Remember It 4 You Wholesale #geowebchat

@mappingmashups Feb 14, 12:49pm Next #geowebchat: The Geography of Lifelogging. Guest host: @re_sieber… Tues Feb 18, 12pm PST

@mappingmashups Feb 14, 12:51pm @aaronpk @caseorganic you (or someone you know) might be interested in our upcoming #geowebchat about lifelogging:…

@mappingmashups Feb 17, 2:21pm Tomorrow (Tuesday) at 12pm PST: #geowebchat about #lifelogging lead by @re_sieber. Food for thought here:…

@re_sieber 10:14am In anticipation of today’s #geowebchat on #lifelogging, a patent for archiving experiences based on geographic cues…

@mappingmashups 10:20am Today (Tuesday) on #geowebchat we’re discussing #lifelogging. More info:… Join us at 12pm PST, 3pm EST, 8pm GMT.

@re_sieber 10:24am Re #lifelogging #geowebchat,… “Reminisc’g prev locs tgthr tightens soc bonds.” Must everythg digital strengthen ties?

@re_sieber 10:26am I’m increasingly convinced that geography is the low hanging fruit of archiving, categorizing any #bigdata, inc #lifelogging. #geowebchat

@re_sieber 10:43am In anticipation of today’s #geowebchat, categorizing #lifelogging by where a person lingers… Hm, lifelogging flaneurs.

@re_sieber 10:45am @scottbellSK: we’re #geowebchat-ting today at 3pmET on #lifelogging

@bricker 11:13am #geowebchat @nytimes Fitbit Review conclusion matches that of Kessler 2011 #CaGIS who cares? No one looking.

@re_sieber 12:01pm Welcome to the #geowebchat on #lifelogging

@mappingmashups 12:01pm Hello everyone, welcome to today’s #geowebchat about #lifelogging. @re_sieber has posted a some Qs to get us started:…

@re_sieber 12:02pm First question for #geowebchat: Are you #lifelogging? If so, how?

@re_sieber 12:02pm Are you instagramming meals, using fitbit, posting status updates, social checkins? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:03pm Also, welcome lurkers to #geowebchat. It’s your chance to tweet hello.

@erictheise 12:04pm i have 12,156 4sq checkins; when i find the right gadget, i’ll probably capture fitness data #lifelogging #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:04pm .@floraandflying, how are you lifelogging? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:06pm @erictheise What drives you to #lifelogging? Is it ab capturing geography? #geowebchat

@erictheise 12:06pm i also belong to a #QuantifiedSelf meetup ( but have only attended one or two meetings #geowebchat

@underdarkGIS 12:06pm If I would be lifelogging, I wouldn’t put the data in the cloud. #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:07pm @re_sieber Does it still count as #lifelogging if you are purposely giving incorrect information? #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:07pm @re_sieber I’ve found when I do #lifelogging, I rarely look at the data later. The immediate social aspects more gratifying. #geowebchat

@funksoup 12:07pm @re_sieber @mappingmashups Hi from NYC & the ether. Happy to join this #geowebchat!

@erictheise 12:07pm it’s about augmenting memory, @re_sieber, geography is part of it, but assisting recall is the driver #geowebchat

@erictheise 12:08pm that’s #lieLogging, @AngharadStone #geowebchat

@funksoup 12:09pm #geowebchat I’m into #lifelogging ‘lite’ & have been mostly instagramming these days tho was an early adopter of twitter, 4square, etc.

@re_sieber 12:09pm .@AngharadStone Throwing chaff into wind usage of #lifelogging is fascinating. Highlights tension btwn real (fitbit)&performance #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:10pm @mappingmashups What are the immediate social benies of #lifelogging if not reexamining the data? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:11pm @funksoup @mappingmashups Hi from NYC as well (112th&Broadway) #geowebchat

@funksoup 12:11pm #geowebchat @erictheise it’s abt augmenting memory but also sourcing the hive. As Deleuze might say: reaching out beyond our sound walls

@eramirez 12:12pm #geowebchat Saw you’re talking about lifelogging & location. Check out a vis of 3.5yrs of 4sq checkins… by @johnschrom

@mappingmashups 12:12pm @re_sieber @AngharadStone perhaps whether or not you’d lie distinguishes personal #lifelogging from social media performance? #geowebchat

@enf 12:13pm @re_sieber I’ve been carrying around a GPS receiver for ages, the main result being things like… #geowebchat

@erictheise 12:13pm @re_sieber, immediate benefits include knowing that @mappingmashups is at the grocery co-op at the same time i’m there. #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:14pm @erictheise so was your check-in at the Four Square church a #lielog? (has been bothering me for ages) #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 12:15pm @re_sieber comparing own immediate performance to others (like on @Strava)… Is that #lifelogging or just a diff use of tool! #geowebchat

@erictheise 12:16pm ha ha, @AngharadStone, that was completely for real, i even included a picture of the church of foursqare #geowebchat

@spara 12:16pm If you had an Android phone and gmail, Google would conveniently provide track of you movements #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:17pm .@mappingmashups @Strava so #lifelogging is performance as opposed to performativity (eg on social media)? #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:18pm @mappingmashups @re_sieber sorry could you explain social media performance? #geowebchat

@erictheise 12:18pm #lifelogging proves innocence in #lieLogging charge:… #geowebchat

@funksoup 12:19pm #geowebchat Immediate benefits of #lifelogging=immediacy of feedback/rscs & linking the physical to the digital

@spara 12:20pm Devices like Google Glass and Narrative life catalog your POV vs devices such as FitBit that catalog your reaction. Data fusion #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:21pm @AngharadStone @mappingmashups Performance-soc media is person you want to be, not person you are. Warrior not couch tater #geowebchat

@wilsonism 12:22pm #geowebchat I tend to think of #lifelogging as just another permutation of conspicuous mobility, a new tactic for the waning #checkin

@re_sieber 12:22pm Q2: 2. Where’s the geography in all of this #lifelogging? Or is it all ab time (eg @ericthiese)? #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:25pm @re_sieber where you would have got a map made of your “empire”, now your #lifelog is your “empire” #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:27pm @AngharadStone #lifelogging becomes your terra cognito, your discovering territory #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:28pm @AngharadStone When you are totally captured only then can you evoke total ownership of your #lifelogging territory? #geowebchat

@funksoup 12:29pm #geowebchat Bringing in dimension of geography ties physical place to digital space in concrete way. Re-defines how we can ‘touch’

@re_sieber 12:30pm… proposes activity identification, segmentation from point clusters. Lingering determines place #geowebchat

@geothinkca 12:30pm #geowebchat mobile geographies and the travelling self – documented stories both fiction and fact for some and all that want to listen?

@geothinkca 12:31pm #geowebchat – Humboldt documented the other over there – now we document ourselves right here…or there

@spara 12:31pm The problem with #lifelogging is that all your data goes to the device manufacturer by default. #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:32pm Big challenge in #lifelogging is categ, archiving #bigdata. Hence use of geog to create value shoud ppl recollect their data #geowebchat

@geothinkca 12:33pm @spara chx out no device need on the extreme end. #geowebchat – but easy and access are king.

@re_sieber 12:33pm .@geothinkca #lifelogging as the internal geography, the sinews of our personal cartography #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:35pm .@spara mentions the corporate capture of #lifelogging, good lead-in into Q3: What are the implications of #lifelogging? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:37pm Q2. recap: I thought #geowebchat’ers would talk tech w regards to #lifelogging geographies. Instead it’s personal cartographies.

@geothinkca 12:37pm @re_sieber well then #geowebchat internal sure – interpreted by outside absolutely – either one or the other at any point probably not

@floraandflying 12:37pm @re_sieber damn, too late. I’m instagramming. uploading to flickr and putting in a 365 collection & geotagging some locs. #geowebchat

@floraandflying 12:38pm @re_sieber and for fitness (such that it is), Fitbit records my activity or lack of it. #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:38pm @re_sieber @spara Should we be worried about the implications of #lifelogging? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:39pm .@floraandflying What’s the implication of all your #lfelogging via instagram sharing? #geowebchat

@funksoup 12:40pm @re_sieber #geowebchat Implications of #lifelogging:privacy of course & obsolescence – what happens if/when that platform/svc goes belly up?

@geothinkca 12:40pm @AngharadStone @re_sieber @spara #geowebchat will we be required to produce annual reports like annual income taxes?

@re_sieber 12:41pm .@floraandflying fitbit records the memory of your Ernest activity #geowebchat

@erictheise 12:41pm @re_sieber could you expand your recap of q2? i don’t understand what you’re saying about your expectations. #geowebchat

@spara 12:41pm @re_sieber @floraandflying We analyze instagram photos and get data from them. #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:42pm @geothinkca @AngharadStone @spara Will we have to reconcile our fitbit activity to our New Year’s resolutions? #geowebchat #MyTechnologyLies

@funksoup 12:42pm #geowebchat @re_sieber Also, our #lifelogging is subject to the constantly changing landscape of TOS’s. #OurDataIsNotOurOwn

@floraandflying 12:42pm @re_sieber nothing really. Just like to remember where I have been and what shoes I was wearing. Emerging patterns too. #geowebchat

@geothinkca 12:43pm @spara @re_sieber @floraandflying #geowebchat – cool Feature detection, meta-tags – other – all the above?

@floraandflying 12:43pm @re_sieber yes. that too! #geowebchat

@spara 12:43pm @re_sieber @geothinkca @AngharadStone If you want to measure progress, then yes. #geowebchat

@floraandflying 12:43pm @spara @re_sieber Spara – need to learn more about this. Let’s connect. #geowebchat

@geothinkca 12:43pm @spara @re_sieber @AngharadStone #geowebchat – Yikes – I just got an eerie feeling.

@re_sieber 12:44pm @erictheise I thought #geowebchat’ers would primarily talk on mashing up #lifelogging maps. Instead more imaginary, personal mappings.

@floraandflying 12:44pm @geothinkca @spara @re_sieber location info, mood – interior – cranky, exterior/outdoors – happy? Weather? #geowebchat

@spara 12:45pm @floraandflying @geothinkca @re_sieber most of those things, there’s a lot of data in photos that’s not currently being used #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:46pm In an era of total capture, measure of a man via heartrate, can I be my imagined WOW self? My aspiration, not my reality #geowebchat

@floraandflying 12:46pm @spara @geothinkca @re_sieber people, metadata is the new black and our photos even machine tags have a lot of useful info. #geowebchat

@geothinkca 12:46pm @floraandflying @spara @re_sieber #geowebchat Would really like to get with you on that after the chat! Sounds intriguing!

@spara 12:46pm #geowebchat I’m currently analyzing happening after-hours venues for SXSW

@geothinkca 12:47pm #geowebchat I currently make sure I try to erase my logs as I make them – count?

@re_sieber 12:47pm Prize in social network analysis is capturing actual behavior, not perception. #lifelogging (esp ambient kind) allows that #geowebchat

@spara 12:48pm #geowebchat Here’s what we analyze from Instagram photos…

@re_sieber 12:49pm #lifelogging (eg w Google Glass) can create new redlining. “Hey nobody seems to go here. So I won’t.” #geowebchat

@geothinkca 12:50pm @re_sieber removes the self-identity bias when out of our control (i.e., set it and forget it) logging. #geowebchat

@AngharadStone 12:51pm @re_sieber @erictheise “the act of #lifelogging is the “invasion” visualizing it afterward is the marking of our “empire” #geowebchat

@erictheise 12:51pm also the hipster/yogi berra version, @re_sieber, ‘hey everybody seems to go here, so i won’t”. #geowebchat

@geothinkca 12:51pm @spara moustache people as catagories!@!@!@! amazing! #geowebchat

@spara 12:52pm #geowebchat Some preliminary hexbinning of SXSW from Instagram data

@re_sieber 12:54pm .@spara @AngharadStone “my lifelog is boring” sounds lk “I have nothing to hide.” Spurious correl can tell something ab you #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:55pm Final thoughts on any questions re #lifelogging inc Q4. What happens if your digital diary is damaged? #geowebchat

@funksoup 12:56pm @spara re: hexbinning SXSW – Nice. Assuming the darker orange bits are where the serious parties are. ;) #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:57pm @re_sieber If #lifelogging site goes down in future will that be digital Alzheimers? #geowebchat

@re_sieber 12:59pm Future privacy implications of #lifelogging. Pervasive CCTVs could partially explain ASBO beh in UK. “What do I have to lose?” #geowebchat

@spara 12:59pm @funksoup #geowebchat Correct, that’s where the most photos were taken from midnight to 5:00 AM for the entire event

@geothinkca 1:00pm @re_sieber internettimemachine and never forget you were in better shape last year! #geowebchat

@re_sieber 1:00pm Thanks everyone for a fun hour on #lifelogging via #geowebchat. Be sure to create an entry ab this twitter event in your own lifelog. ;-)

@erictheise 1:01pm hmmm, we didn’t explicitly mention self-censorship in #lifelogging. skipping bad workouts and dubious checkins. #geowebchat

@re_sieber 1:01pm Feel free to continue the conversation on #lifelogging #geowebchat

@spara 1:01pm #geowebchat I highly recommend this episode of Black Mirror… when it comes to #lifelogging

@geothinkca 1:02pm thanks @re_sieber interesting chat! #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 1:02pm Amazing episode! RT @spara: #geowebchat I highly recommend this episode of Black Mirror… when it comes to #lifelogging

@funksoup 1:02pm @re_sieber Thx for the #geowebchat! If we lifelog this #lifelogging event, will it create a rupture in the time-space continuum? #MetaMeta

@re_sieber 1:02pm @erictheise “self-censorship in #lifelogging” YES like strategic tracking apps like placeavoid #geowebchat

@mappingmashups 1:03pm Thanks @re_sieber for running a great #geowebchat! Next one will be in two weeks on March 4. Topic TBD.

@spara 1:04pm @mappingmashups This was also a great episode dealing with our digital detritus embodied… #geowebchat #lifelogging

@re_sieber 1:04pm & that’s why I prefer American #sf to UK RT @spara: #geowebchat I highly recommend this episode of Black Mirror…

@re_sieber 1:06pm @funksoup We can avoid rupture in the time-space continuum when lifelogging this #lifelogging event if we collect nec metadata #geowebchat

@funksoup 1:07pm @spara @mappingmashups re: digital detritus embodied -see also #geowebchat #lifelogging

@spara 1:09pm @funksoup @mappingmashups The dream of apotheosis #geowebchat #lifelogging

@mpmckenna8 1:10pm Way cool @foursquare suggests users help edit @openstreetmap. Useful #lifelogging #geowebchat

@Brobdingnag 2:26pm @re_sieber Yeah, I’m curious about what this means for safety. Lots of people here so it must be safe/notsafe #geowebchat

@re_sieber 2:37pm #lifelogging to visualize differences in air pollution city-to-city from @SenseableCity #geowebchat

@re_sieber 3:01pm Apple also wants entry into #lifelogging with its patents for sensors embedded in earbuds… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 19, 12:53pm Google to Glass users: stop being glassholes… #geosurveillance #geowebchat Forgot being a jerk 1 reason 4 #lifelogging

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Next #geowebchat: The Geography of Lifelogging or Dear Diary on Steroids, guest host: @re_sieber, Feb 18, 2014, 12pm PST

[Guest post by Renee Sieber]

What is lifelogging? You capture your personal data with computer hardware. More recently, this personal data also may be captured via services or apps and are maintained in the cloud. Unlike blogging, the capture is generally passive, like sleep patterns (e.g., Sleepbot) or travel habits (e.g., with Google Glass), although it can include mining from emails or online documents (or computer time–Rescue Time tracks the time you spend on your computer–see

To this point, Sellen and Whittaker (2010, 72, via

“distinguish between lifelogging and other more deliberate activities involving the capture of personal data (such as digital photography and blogging) that involve the effortful selective capture and display of digital materials for a particular audience. In contrast, lifelogging seeks to be effortless and all-encompassing in terms of data capture.”

What technologies are involved or envisioned? Lifelogging can possibly be embedded in any number of devices (e.g., toothbrushes, shoes, shirt, toilets, fishing reels and other non-track sports equipment). It can be dedicated hardware like Fitbit or narrative clip. The most obvious hardware is your cellphone, which can track location or time; it can photograph or video your life. It can even monitor your battery usage. The device of the moment is Google Glass, which can capture searches, conversations, documents, and visual images. Software or apps can include Instagram (e.g., your meals), Google Docs, or Foursquare.

What are the goals of lifelogging? Sellen and Whitalker mention five:

  • recollecting (e.g., reliving the experience, perhaps to accommodate a memory impairment)
  • reminiscing (similar to the nostalgia of “home movies”)
  • retrieving
  • reflecting (looking at archived data from different perspectives like past behaviour patterns)
  • remembering what needs to be/should be done

I’d add a few more:

  • improving (e.g., language skills, driving, running, weight, in home energy usage)
  • obsessing with the minute to minute personal observation (narcissism) — the quantified self movement
  • digital hoarding
  • sharing your tracks (also called life caching). There are several possible motivations for this:
    • a deep drive to express oneself
    • performing (a kind of digital acting broadcast to an audience, e.g., via instagram)
    • guilt and shaming (e.g., what women aren’t supposed to be eating or where they shouldn’t be going, cf. Dobson and Fisher’s (2003) concept of geoslavery,
    • altruism (with patientslikeme, cure together, sharing tracked personal medical information to improve collective understanding of medication conditions)
    • keeping in touch (but should you share all these details, indulgences, intimacy with your loved ones?)
    • getting money (maybe you’re a patient 0 of some type? Maybe you’re an Olympic athlete whose patterns others seek to emulate)
    • learning from others (e.g., their logged data such as successful romance patterns)

Here are questions we can cover in the twitter chat:

1. How and why are you logging your life? How deliberate is your lifelogging? Do you need to wear the device or take the photo? Is there iLifelogging (where the i stands for involuntary)?

Consider that lifelogging could cover (depending on what you read):

  • email, chats, documents, credit cards, websites visited
  • archives (photos, book lists, e.g., in librarything)
  • your own shopping patterns (Amazon Prime)
  • ambient tracking (on or off your person): home temperature, cellphone battery usage, traffic congestion (from your in car navigation), door openings (office, refrigerator); travel patterns (e.g., from your own Oyster card)
  • biometric tracking (your heart rate)

Does the technology choice matter in expressing yourself?

2. Where’s the geography in all of this?

Lifelogging appears to be predominantly a temporal activity, as opposed to a geographic activity. Via lifelogging we have a timeline, when we can not only look backwards but also forward through time in a kind of predictive modeling. We can apply this also to place (e.g., organize and archive activities by place; examine the different things I did at the same place; examine the seasonality of a place in terms of activities; create a shortest path analyses through space and time). See We could use spatial techniques to conduct a social network analysis or a self organizing map of lifelogging.

3. What is the future of lifelogging? What are its implications?

The first possible future (present?) is a complete loss of privacy: the surveilled and profiled life. The sf book Light of Other Days (Baxter and Clarke) speculate about a life without privacy and the outrageous behaviour provoked by that loss. If your life is completely open; what do you have to lose in terms of your behaviour (I think Baxter and Clarke, being British, were thinking of ASBOs)? Maybe privacy shouldn’t be our primary concern. Like oversharing on social networking sites, this could be a generational issue that only non-lifelogging natives (i.e., old fogeys) worry about. Conversely, Steve Mann (the father of wearable computers) talks of sousveillance, the ability to counter surveillance with a watching of our own. If we’re to lose privacy then lifelogging could restore control of our patterns to us.

If we engage in a near total capture of our lives then we’d need the ability to forget or to blank out places we don’t want recorded (e.g., placeavoid). Unfortunately, the ability to avoid could become the new place discriminator. Our activities determine the “right and wrong” places to go. By crowdsourcing, we produce the new redlining (i.e., the red line around this neighbourhood represents a no go zone). This is more insidious than our tweets and facebook posts. We may express more liberal attitudes regarding place; our actual behaviour tells a more conservative story.

In the cloud, you are the consumer (or in the case of lifelogging, the tracker). But you are also the product. Lifelogging offers new opportunities for data mining and valuation of a new source of big data. A totally captured life is a monetizable life. If so then what part of your life is not monetized? Perhaps there are benefits to the total capture lifeloggers, those with the luxury of time and money to log. Consider perks that are available to those with high KLOUT and KRED scores. These benefits would be unavailable to those with reduced resources (unless maybe they’d be willing to lease their lives for lifelogging).

More benignly, Web 2.0 allows you to managing multiple and possibly conflicting roles, relationships, and identities in life. You can be performative rather than real. Indeed your performance may be more authentic than your day-to-day mundane activities. It could be expressed in strategic tracking, for example turning on the trackers when you’re visiting an exciting place but not when you’re denting the couch cushions.

But lifelogging, especially total capture, can interject real life measures. For instance, you may claim membership in an elite class of long distance runners but your heart rate may tell a different story. We’re all allowed a certain level of exaggeration in our lives. Certainly our avatars in MMORPGs suggest outsized identities. But for some segments of society (the closeted gay, the disabled), the reveal of the real could be devastating.

Lastly, if lifelogging allows us to capture “real” memories then why can’t we acquire false memories? Philip K Dick imagined this in We Can Remember It for You Wholesale, which was later made into the film, Total Recall. We don’t have the technology yet to make memory capture and recall a complete cyborg activity but we could imagine a time in which our past is augmented with a juiced up version of our boring life.

4. What happens if your digital diary is damaged?

What happens to you when a part of the cloud goes down; an app goes bankrupt; a device is no longer upwardly compatible; or the service denies you access? Your memory and the patterns of your life can no longer be totally recalled.


As always, #geowebchat will be held on Twitter for one hour, starting at 12pm PST, 3pm EST, 8pm GMT, on Tuesday February 18, 2014. We look forward to chatting with you!

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#geowebchat transcript: 4 February 2014: discussion about #opendata

@mappingmashups Feb 04, 9:28am Today (Tue Feb 4) on #geowebchat: @geothinkca hosts a discussion on #opendata. More info here:…

@rastrau Feb 04, 11:31am Maybe sth for @odi @OpenDataZurich and @sfkeller:… It’s on in 30 mins. #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 11:38am @rastrau @OpenDataZurich @sfkeller thanks for this pointer, looks kind of like “my” topic :) #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:00pm Welcome everyone to the #geowebchat on #opendata

@mappingmashups Feb 04, 12:00pm Hello everyone, welcome to another #geowebchat. Today @geothinkca will be guest-hosting a chat about #opendata:…

@mappingmashups Feb 04, 12:01pm As always, if you want to join the conversation, just follow the #geowebchat hashtag, and make sure you include it in all your tweets.

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:01pm Welcome to our first guest hosting of #geowebchat. Today’s topic is Open Data. More infor here:

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:02pm #Opendata: data shud b freely available 2 everyone to use, repub as they wish, wo restrictions frm copyright, patents or control #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:02pm Quick thanks to all of you joining us for #geowebchat today and @mappingmashups for letting us host!

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:02pm We’d like to hear all your inputs on Open Data – in terms of access/ usability/quality/impact/issues for the #geoweb / #opendata #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:03pm Any new tweeters today on #geowebchat for #opendata?

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:03pm @re_sieber obviously this depends…on what data mostly. #geowebchat

@SamuelLeach Feb 04, 12:03pm #geowebchat on #opendata just kicking off now.

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:05pm .@peterajohnson Does data qualify as #opendata if it’s somehow restricted, eg by license? #geowebchat

@skorasaurus Feb 04, 12:05pm #opendata isn’t a panacea, esp. w/ civic data & local govt, there needs to easy case uses for it, local ecosystem for it. #geowebchat.

@odi Feb 04, 12:05pm @re_sieber yes here #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:06pm Hopefully we have a good mix of #geowebchat veterans and newcomers ~ feel free to say hello to everyone and as things start #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:06pm @re_sieber can be very good reasons for restrictions (like share alike is a restriction that is very common) #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:07pm @skorasaurus We know from our work w local gov that they frequently need researchers, hackers to provide use case #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:07pm @skorasaurus good point – providing #opendata is just step 1, really. Generating long term value is hard. #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:08pm @re_sieber @skorasaurus Touches nicely on “why do we want?” #opendata #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:08pm .@skorasaurus Like to believe local ecosystem is nec for #opendata but I wonder if Googles, lg firms supercede need for local #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:08pm @odi Welcome to #geowebchat!

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:09pm I’d like to hear tweeters’ ideas ab how to value #opendata. Indeed, what is the value of #opendata? #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:09pm @peterajohnson is right, share alike restricts agency’s ability to reuse open data (pub domain is standard) #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:09pm It’s really sad we still have to “sell” Open Data to the govt. It has value in itself! #geowebchat

@sidewalkballet Feb 04, 12:09pm should data be provided for the layman/everyone, or targeted towards skilled users? #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:10pm @odi @skorasaurus If Open Data isn’t cure-all but has value – in what ways? #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:10pm .@USGSTNMRes @peterajohnson Can you give example in 140 characters of how share-alike restricts agency reuse? #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:10pm @odi what about when open data is considered ‘done’ by gov? Box ticked, time to move on. Without evidence of value, why support? #geowebchat

@skorasaurus Feb 04, 12:11pm @re_sieber value of #opendata helps you learn how your govt is working, although sometimes data needs context. #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:11pm @peterajohnson @odi perhaps what is going on here?!/data-catalog… #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:12pm .@odi Data for its own sake is new concept to gov. Data used to be a means to decision making. Not monetizable, reusable #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:12pm @sidewalkballet it should be provided as-is, so this might target skilled users. Those can then condense the data for everybody #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:13pm @sidewalkballet So does #opendata have value only to those who have skills to use it? #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:13pm @re_sieber @peterajohnson USGS can’t use OSM because all data we publish must be pub domain–can’t do CCSA #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:14pm @USGSTNMRes this is really interesting. I suspect that share alike will keep municipal gov from adopting #OSM for many uses #geowebchat

@sidewalkballet Feb 04, 12:14pm @geothinkca primarily, but that value is extended to those who use whatever is built with the data #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:14pm What does concept of transparency in #opendata mean? Transparency 4 data as end in itself or transparency of democracy? Not same #geowebchat

@rastrau Feb 04, 12:15pm .@geothinkca Shouldn’t. Need to make sure questions that get asked can come from everybody not just eg programmers #geowebchat #inclusion

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:15pm @USGSTNMRes I was looking at #osm license and trying to figure if municipal gov internal use would need to share alike #geowebchat y/n?

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:16pm @SamuelLeach @USGSTNMRes I think for internal use, gov could use #osm with own data and not share alike… #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:17pm @odi @sidewalkballet strong role for private sector, community groups as intermediaries between citizens and #opendata #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:17pm @rastrau Agreed – so Palo Alto’s use of fushion tables provide the non-expert mean to view open data #geowebchat is that #inclusion?

@odi Feb 04, 12:17pm @peterajohnson I think you can’t measure it. We should work towards “open by default”, then there is no “done with Open Data” #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:17pm @peterajohnson if you don’t publish in any form then maybe not? #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:19pm @USGSTNMRes that’s my understanding…but I’m not a lawyer (not even on TV). #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:19pm Great points so far #geowebchat on- Value for experts or Everyone? Share-alike license and limits to adoption by local auth.!

@pdxmele Feb 04, 12:19pm Good discussion going on right now about open data on #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:20pm @peterajohnson @odi @sidewalkballet So #opendata should be transparent in its value to intermediaries but not nec to citizens? #geowebchat

@rastrau Feb 04, 12:20pm @geothinkca Guess it’s an option. Maybe not ‘best’ wrt openness. *Diversity of (ideally open) tools and most basic formats key #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:21pm @peterajohnson @sidewalkballet I agree, this is a new power, a field that previously only the media was active #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:21pm @odi would definitely help with horizontal sharing between levels of gov, regardless of any private sector/citizen benefit #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:21pm @peterajohnson @odi @sidewalkballet We can easily create a situation in which #opendata only/mostly has value for entrepreneurs #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:22pm @re_sieber don’t think opendata will ever be as transparent to citizens as we wish #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:22pm @re_sieber um, no. Just that (like anything) value will be realized by different actors in different ways. Tough to generalize #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:22pm @rastrau which is a problem (i.e., formats for the data) – A CSV isn’t useful for someone that doesn’t know how to open it #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:23pm @USGSTNMRes @re_sieber What’s the motivation to make potentially damaging #opendata? Perhaps shelves efforts right away? #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:24pm .@mpmckenna8 @skorasaurus #Metadata for #opendata! Otherwise, how can we judge eg, why some things are so expensive? #geowebchat

@bgrassbluecrab Feb 04, 12:24pm @geothinkca @rastrau csv’s a problem, yet some comfort in the credibility of data when it’s open, even if no citizens use it #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:24pm @re_sieber No, for me value != money, of course companys can make money, but still citizens can profit from the data #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:24pm @re_sieber just like how roads only have benefits for those who have cars? ;) #geowebchat Think a bit more broadly here…

@sidewalkballet Feb 04, 12:24pm @re_sieber @peterajohnson @odi I’m not so quick to leave the citizens out though. can be used as a learning tool #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:25pm @USGSTNMRes @re_sieber agreed – just like our current system of municipal bylaws and regulations is probably quite opaque #geowebchat

@sidewalkballet Feb 04, 12:26pm @re_sieber @mpmckenna8 @skorasaurus need metadata to minimize uncertainty (of all kinds) #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:26pm @USGSTNMRes @re_sieber I think it is a mistake to require every piece of government work to be immediately consumable by anyone #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:26pm @sidewalkballet @re_sieber @mpmckenna8 @skorasaurus but who makes metadata anymore? #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:27pm @peterajohnson We could easily create a world of #opendata that only serves data to lg firms like Google, schema like GTFS #geowebchat

@mpmckenna8 Feb 04, 12:27pm @re_sieber @skorasaurus Especially for geo data. I’ve gotten rasters of tourism values from @sfmta_muni w/ no metadata+process. #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:27pm @sidewalkballet exactly! One of the goals of Open Government Data is to learn how the gov works, see relations etc. #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:28pm @geothinkca what do you mean by potentially damaging? we def have restrictions on personal info. cld write treatise #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:29pm @re_sieber we already live in a world where government develops services to different sectors. Why shouldn’t open data be G2B? #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:30pm @peterajohnson @USGSTNMRes “mistake to req every bit of gov work to be immediately consumable by anyone” Them’s fightin’ words #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:30pm @USGSTNMRes from spatial data to budgets – often a resistance to ‘open’ comes from a fear of consequence #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:31pm @re_sieber @USGSTNMRes Ok, let me rephrase that last part ‘to be intelligible by anyone’. Availability – ok. #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:31pm @USGSTNMRes privacy is also a huge concern but determing what should and shouldn’t be private not always clear across the board #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:32pm @geothinkca ah metadata. topic for another #geowebchat OR related to opengeodata?????

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:32pm @geothinkca agree! again topic for treatise, not 140 characters #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:33pm @bgrassbluecrab @rastrau @peterajohnson having it accessible is comforting and valuable in its appearance of transparency? #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:33pm .@peterajohnson Gov’s frequently prevented from over involvemt in biz activities, seen as competitors. More so in US than Canada #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:33pm @re_sieber and there is a fine line between accessibility of information and over scrutiny of minutiae #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:33pm @geothinkca again, totally agree #geowebchat

@Brobdingnag Feb 04, 12:34pm @USGSTNMRes .@geothinkca Metadata is more important than data #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:34pm @re_sieber don’t tell the TARP program that…#geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:34pm @USGSTNMRes perhaps both! uncertainty in OpenData/VGI/Authoritative Data alike- metadata and format common issue #geowebchat

@bgrassbluecrab Feb 04, 12:35pm @geothinkca @rastrau @peterajohnson #geowebchat comfort comes from trust that someone w/ stats skills could investigate

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:35pm @Brobdingnag @USGSTNMRes but doesn’t explain why most produsers don’t create it. #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:35pm @peterajohnson why should G2B be different than G2C? All I want is an API and machine readable data #geowebchat

@Brobdingnag Feb 04, 12:35pm @USGSTNMRes @geothinkca Topic for another #geowebchat I think

@rob_giggey Feb 04, 12:35pm @sidewalkballet w/ restricted resources I think u focus on the skilled users first & then to the layman.… #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:36pm @odi exactly! But @re_sieber would argue that an API excludes citizens and plays into corporate hands #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:36pm @Brobdingnag @geothinkca can definitely be more important! #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:37pm @odi @peterajohnson because most of the C’s cant make use of it #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:37pm @peterajohnson @odi APIs exclude most lay citzens. (can’t type 140 characters fast enough) #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:38pm @re_sieber @peterajohnson @odi but most API’s come from the intermediates Open Data source portals offer limited access anyways #geowebchat

@Brobdingnag Feb 04, 12:38pm @geothinkca @USGSTNMRes Yeah, I was always taught to create metadata, but the keyword there is taught #elitism #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:38pm @USGSTNMRes @odi should gov act as #opendata provider and translator to citizens? #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:39pm Challenge is that citizens demand understanding of gov & #opendata implies comprehension #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:40pm @Brobdingnag @USGSTNMRes begs the question of what good is metadata if you have no use for the data?Its up to the citizen/other? #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:41pm @peterajohnson @re_sieber but most OD is raw data, that can’t be processed by common citizen. We need to provide tools for them #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:41pm @peterajohnson @odi Dont know what its like in CA, but in US, we don’t like taxes! So how to fund this new role? #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:41pm Quick recap: Transparency is evident if the data is there? Use of the data restricted by access? Citizen Value in #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:41pm @peterajohnson @re_sieber and with we, I mean the community, everyone! #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:42pm We’ve been discussing #opendata from gov. But data can come from citizens too… #geowebchat What are issues?

@sidewalkballet Feb 04, 12:42pm @odi @peterajohnson @re_sieber can’t be processed, and/or don’t know what to use it for. maybe examples of use would benefit #geowebchat

@eknalprev Feb 04, 12:43pm @re_sieber citizens demand and they expect to understand. There’s the difference #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:43pm @USGSTNMRes @peterajohnson there is no free lunch! #taxes #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:43pm .@odi @peterajohnson #Opendata is not more raw now that it comes in digital form. Long history of citizens pouring over reports #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:43pm @re_sieber u would not believe hoops we have to jump thru to accept data from citizens #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:43pm @odi agreed – intermediaries are critical. Reminds me of the golden age of investigative journalism #geowebchat

@acolt Feb 04, 12:44pm Folks, what’s your main go-to #opendata portal for geo-data? I can list OSM, Natural Earth (, others? #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:44pm @re_sieber @odi @peterajohnson So machine readable is the value in ‘today’s’ open data? #geowebchat Even if you can’t use the machine?

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:44pm @odi @peterajohnson exactly #taxes #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:44pm @odi @USGSTNMRes or outsource it to the non-profits or let corporations take over…realities are fairly obvious #geowebchat

@geovis_isprs Feb 04, 12:45pm #geowebchat on #opendata happening now, join in!

@rastrau Feb 04, 12:45pm @USGSTNMRes @peterajohnson @odi Some people and reports would emphasise the macroeconomic effects of OD > revenues > taxes #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 12:45pm Just like people wrote web browsers to make the web compr., we should create tools and educate people about OpenData #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:46pm RT @geothinkca: @acolt links to many others #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:46pm RT @geothinkca: @acolt #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:46pm @geothinkca @odi @peterajohnson Machine readable, generalizable=currency of #opendata. Transpar to entrepreneur; not nec citizen #geowebchat

@rob_giggey Feb 04, 12:46pm uOttawa Library’s #opendata day event: #hackUObiblio… #geowebchat

@sidewalkballet Feb 04, 12:47pm @acolt found this resource once. Maybe not all “open” #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:47pm @odi Yes. Educating ppl ab #opendata in many ways identical to educating ppl ab gov #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:49pm @re_sieber @odi and the process of education requires intermediaries…;) #geowebchat Can’t expect everyone to pick this stuff up without help

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:49pm @re_sieber @odi Huge efforts already underway? ie @geothinkca @OKFN etc. etc. #geowebchat – How are they engaging citizens? Gov’ and NGO

@odi Feb 04, 12:51pm @geothinkca to be able to dig in the raw data, is the value. It’s the same with OSS, I can use it wo understanding the code. #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:51pm 10 minutes left with today’s #geowebchat ! Civic engagement with #opendata Responsibilities of usability/accessability!

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:51pm @rastrau @USGSTNMRes @peterajohnson @odi “macroecon effects of #opendata” See sim argumt @ lower levels of gov but harder 2track #geowebchat

@peterajohnson Feb 04, 12:53pm Have to run, but great #geowebchat looking forwards to the continued evolution of #opendata questions of value, adoption, evaluation!

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:53pm @re_sieber @rastrau @peterajohnson @odi fortunately don’t know what macroecon means! ;) #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:53pm @geothinkca There should be a code of ethics for #opendata. 1. Don’t misrepresent original intent of data #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:53pm @peterajohnson Thanks for joining in! #geowebchat

@USGSTNMRes Feb 04, 12:54pm Gotta go…good questions/issues thx #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:54pm @USGSTNMRes @rastrau @peterajohnson @odi macroeconomic, like #opendata will create 10000 new silicon valley type jobs #geowebchat

@rob_giggey Feb 04, 12:55pm if there’s any @opendataottawa folks online/interested there’s a #geowebchat going on right now.. #opendata.

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:55pm @re_sieber Which is transparency? Economic stimulus? Citizen empowerment? All the above plus some? #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:56pm Great discussions on today’s #geowebchat We have 5 min. left feel free to make your closing remarks!

@odi Feb 04, 12:56pm @geothinkca there are already tons of projects. Some events get a lot of attraction, this is where you actually _explain_ data #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:57pm @geothinkca Some techie types see transparency only as machine readable, generalizable (eg across cities). Stuff good for apps #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 12:58pm @odi agreed! and supporting those that work and making more like them seem like a much needed effort #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 12:59pm @geothinkca I’d argue for transparency for democracy. But there’s chasm btwn transparency as downloadable & transp as empowermt #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 1:01pm @re_sieber but having access to the ‘raw data’ on what is being done by your rep’s is empowering grassroots etc. KnowledgePower #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 1:01pm @geothinkca more thoughts about Open Data events are in my recent blog post:… #shamelessselfplug #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 1:02pm @geothinkca One thing we’ve discovered w tech, data is the Knowledge does not eq power (unless you already have power) #geowebchat

@geothinkca Feb 04, 1:02pm Ok everyone that was an exciting hour of #geowebchat today – I will close off by thanking you that joined and @mappingmashups for the spot

@geothinkca Feb 04, 1:03pm Don’t feel that the talk needs to end now – and if you couldn’t join #geowebchat today we will let you know when the transcript is posted

@re_sieber Feb 04, 1:03pm @odi @geothinkca great post,…. Will be interesting to hear @opennorth response #geowebchat

@mappingmashups Feb 04, 1:04pm Thanks @geothinkca for hosting today’s #geowebchat today, great job! Next chat will be in two weeks on Feb 18. Topic TBD.

@re_sieber Feb 04, 1:05pm thanks #geothinkca for getting #geowebchat ers to think ab #opendata. Hope to continue the conversation!

@sidewalkballet Feb 04, 1:05pm @geothinkca @mappingmashups thank ya thank ya lovely thinkin’ and chattin’ #opendata #geothink #geowebchat

@mappingmashups Feb 04, 1:06pm @re_sieber when would you like to host a #geowebchat about life logs?

@geothinkca Feb 04, 1:07pm @odi @re_sieber @opennorth only gotten a bit into it but certainly looks cross applicable #geowebchat

@re_sieber Feb 04, 1:08pm @mappingmashups Yes. Lifelogging: every meal you’ve eaten and every step you’ve walked #geowebchat

@Burchfie Feb 04, 1:09pm .@geothinkca @re_sieber Thanks for the #geowebchat today–was only able to lurk occasionally. Good discussion. Hope to chat more nxt time.

@geothinkca Feb 04, 1:10pm @sidewalkballet @odi @rob_giggey @rastrau and everyone else I couldn’t find the names for fast-enough Thanks for participating! #geowebchat

@odi Feb 04, 1:13pm @geothinkca thanks for hosting the #geowebchat Was a great experience, especially for me as a first-timer ;)

@geothinkca Feb 04, 1:15pm @odi great to have you and feel free to follow and #geowebchat @mappingmashups hosts some great topics here!

@odi Feb 04, 1:15pm @rastrau thanks again, this was really interesting! #geowebchat

@iaindillingham Feb 04, 2:11pm @acolt Global Administrative Areas is my favourite #opendata #geowebchat

@opendataottawa Feb 04, 2:29pm Happens monthly on 1st & 3rd Tues @ 3 EST RT @rob_giggey: if there’s any folks online/interested there’s a #geowebchat going on right now

@mappingmashups Feb 04, 4:37pm RT @tranlib: Get ready for #opendataday with the Local Open Data Census from @OKFN… #opendata #geowebchat

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